Can't blame the pilots for not noticing at the last moment. You can read 3 more free articles without a subscription. Secondly, cockpit crew are frequently unaware of exactly what Secondly, cockpit crew are frequently unaware of exactly what is going on behind them, in respect of unusual flap, mounting, engine problems, only aided recently by tailcams. Frontier permite a las personas ir a lugares inesperados, ya sea a nuestro centro principal en Denver o a nuestras ubicaciones internacionales en Mxico, Canad . I operated that flight and the story is a little inaccurate. EJC and Redman, perhaps you should accept the principle that the PIC bears ultimate responsibility, and maybe your accepted/past practices aren't good enough. En octubre de 2021, un Boeing de Qantas que viajaba desde la ciudad australiana de Perth a Adelaide en Australia Occidental fue desviado debido a un desequilibrio de combustible, en un hecho clasificado como "incidente grave". Frontier fue el cliente de lanzamiento del Airbus A318; entre 2003 y 2007, recibieron 11 del tipo. I flew from YUL to LGA several years ago. Siempre que ocurre un accidente de aviacin, los expertos recurren a cifras que comprueban cmo, en trminos estadsticos, el transporte areo sigue siendo muy seguro. Memories of Palm 90 tragedy, Washington National to Tampa, January 13, 1982. They ask "how did this happen?" And very well put. Sure, well just shut down the plane out there on the taxiway and open the cabin door, blow the slide and hop down for a closer look. Text Us directly on WhatsApp. Tambin ha sido pionera en el empleo de sofisticados sistemas de navegacin area. Hopefully multiple someones got throughly kicked in this instance! Insider enumer las tres categoras que ms contribuyeron a la calificacin total. Do you realize how many hundreds of aspects of every flight you have For the people outraged that the pilots dont inspect the plane post deicing, youre out of your element. Visibility is paramount. In the US the TSA is responsible for checking passengers as well as their luggage and making sure that no prohibited items are present. We fly in the clouds and do what ATC says when we cant see. Get access to AeroInside Insights, unlimited read access and receive the daily newsletter. Are you researching aviation incidents? The comments on this page have not been provided, reviewed, approved or otherwise endorsed by any advertiser, and it is not an advertiser's responsibility to ensure posts and/or questions are answered. Some aircraft are on the ground 70 minutes between flights, some are there 24 hours. Your feedback is important in helping us keep our community safe. It has been quite a day on social media with a video circulating of an unruly passenger on Frontier Airlines getting taped to a seat after an inflight altercation with the crew. What do you make of the Frontier incident? Discover how AeroInside supports your aviation research. About this app. Deicing ops is all about trust, if everyone perform his job right, in this case the deice crew, they were supposed to first removed the snow with type 1 and then apply a type 4 to protect it before take off. The flight attendant did her job well and should be commended. Continuing to make the flight crews fly blind of all behind the pit is utterly unacceptable & violates all safety & redundancy protocols already in place & championed by all. We thank you for your service in making our communities a stronger, safer and better place to live in. The captain is not a mechanic and would be unable to make as thorough of an inspection as a mechanic is trained to do. Photo: Getty Images, Several last-minute changes have occurred over the last few weeks. La primera categora, equipaje y salidas, fue What happened to this flight was criminal. It cant be overstated how major this issue could have been several fatal plane crashes have occurred over the years due to deicing, so huge kudos to the flight attendant who was so observant (or perhaps a passenger who informed the flight attendant, with the flight attendant relaying the information to the pilots). En trminos de otros hallazgos clave, Delta Air Lines fue nombrada la aerolnea ms confiable, mientras que la menos confiable fue Frontier Airlines. 2023 Cable News Network. We believe the flight attendants when they say everyone is ready in the back. Visibility is paramount. As a person that works for an airline I have some skin in the game to make sure the cargo/other doors are closed, the aircraft is free from contaminants, the de icing fluid freeze point is within limits, my crew trained and my truck/ storage tanks are full. First officer walked back to confirm. Sin embargo, eso no cambia el natural nerviosismo que la mayora sentimos al poner nuestras vidas en manos de las aerolneas que nos transportan. Camera technology is proven & would be a relatively cheap fix for monitoring for deicing needs, monitoring the deicing procedure itself, & making a post-deice review simple & quick. It does seem, though, that adding a visual check after de-icing and before takeoff, possibly by a flight attendant, would add some level of extra protection. It's great that so many Pilots and Airline professionals are reading and weighing in. Circumstances: Frontier Airlines Flight 32 of March 12, 1964, crashed and burned during an instrument approach to the Miles City Airport, Miles City, Montana, about 2050 m.s.t. Outside of banner ads published through the Boarding Area network, this compensation does not impact how and where products appear on this site. We were highly trained and properly motivated, people making good money seem to have a vested interest in keeping people safe and retaining their job. "Tambin ocup un lugar bajo en trminos de seguridad, ya que registr al menos una lesin fatal en accidentes de . Someone messed up and good thing for the flight attendant or maybe a few passengers that tole him/her. Depending on specific airline procedures, either the mechanic will communicate with the cockpit crew or a deicing coordinator will. That translated to $70 - $80k today. I think you're misunderstanding the situation. Snow, ice, freezing rain, sleet and freezing fog are sprayed with HOT Type I in the deice pad adjacent to rwy 6 allowing for a quick departure after As a private pilot and deicing operator/driver at BDL (Bradley airport, Windsor Locks, CT) we spray HOT Type I for frost at the gates on overnight aircraft before they're loaded for the first flight approximately 1-2 hours before their departures in the wee hours of the morning. Follow him on social media for all his latest travel updates. Subscribe now and continue reading without any limits! (Photo by AaronP/Bauer-Griffin/GC Images), There has been an increase of unruly passengers in the United States in the last 13 months. While the deicers informed the pilots that the plane was clear of contaminants, that wasn't the case. I am a flight attendant, had similar incident on night flight. Adems, Kal-Star Aviation, Sriwijaya Air, TransNusaTrigana, Air Service, Wings Air y Xpress Air. Even though the aircraft was allegedly deiced at a remote (non-gate) location, it's the pilots' responsibility to ensure the aircraft is safe for flight operations. Pretty sickening considering. @Peter Brown, it is not at all common practice for pilots to visually verify de ice application. At some point everyone has to rely on the word of another, and documentation goes a long way to proving that. Los seis pasajeros y los dos miembros de la tripulacin murieron. Frontier Airlines, Frontier Airlines airplane accidents and other occurrences. Opinions expressed here are the authors alone, and have not been reviewed, approved or otherwise endorsed by any of these entities. Another big question has been the role of alcohol in unruly passenger incidents. 01:08 Airbus to stop making superjumbo A380 02:33 World's largest plane flies for the first time. There is not time or any safe way for the pilot to check the plane; the engines are already running when the anti-ice fluid is applied, and the plane must take off within minutes after application. Flight cancelled, everyone safe. La aerolnea de bandera de Australia ocupa el sptimo lugar esta vez debido a un "leve aumento en los incidentes junto con la antigedad de la flota". Ese ltimo ao hubo 21 accidentes serios con 986 muertes, mientras que en 2015 se presentaron 16 accidentes serios con 560 vctimas fatales, asegura airlineratings.com El promedio para los. You'd be a lot better off trying to ask intelligent questions rather than pretending to know answers--which you mostly do not. All five occupants, three crew members and two passengers were killed, and the aircraft was destroyed. You realize that type of deicing is done on the way to the runway with engines running. We dont do a type 1 (snow ice removal) and type 4 protective coat that sheds any accumulated snow on take off while parked at the gate. The video of the incident is linked below. Its common practice for pilots to trust deicers, just as theyd trust other people integral to the operation. ELITE Simulation Solutions is a leading global provider of Flight Simulation Training Devices, IFR training software as well as flight controls and related services. El estudio de airlineratings.com toma varios factores en consideracin para sus calificaciones, incluyendo auditoras realizados por gobiernos, el historial de accidentes fatales de la aerolnea y otras mediciones llevadas a cabo por asociaciones en la industria de la aviacin civil. That translated to $70 - $80k today. Take a quick walk around the damn airplane before closing the door and firing up. Seems like such a simple solution for a ton of flying issues (engine catastrophe, landing gears, deicing), Im told authoritatively; pilots not to blame here not routine for them to inspect after deicing. The only time, as I understand it, when the crew need to take a second look is if they are held on the taxiway and takeoff is delayed, thereby causing a second build up of ice, which would need a gate return for secondary de icing. It seems quite obvious that many readers here have never been on a plane while it is deiced. Every time. The potential for liability alone should instigate a resolution. The pilots did everything right. Another superb example of the value of Crew Resource Management. We were highly trained and properly motivated, people making good money seem to have a vested interest in keeping people safe and retaining their job. Many moons ago, AA #90 ORD LHR. Actually the crew IS responsible. They have been on the front lines of the pandemic, installing and maintaining communications services for their customers, ensuring their local communities are able to work and attend school remotely and in-person, receive . acelerada por la pandemia y los retiros masivos de pilotos que fueron necesarios para. Our customer self-service tool below can help with changes to existing reservations! We are here to support you with your inquiries 24/7. How do you suppose they check the tail? and I roll my eyes. Those customers may not remember to take off their belt at TSA or may not remember they need to present their ID to check a bag. Now a visual check of the nose in front of the cockpit, combined with not exceeding holdover time suffices. Let's Chat. Demoras: 1.13/18; Negativa de abordaje: 0/15 . The articles cover air safety incidents for Publicidad. "We are supporting the needs of these team members and are working with law enforcement to fully support the prosecution of the passenger involved. Evenings, weekends and holidays a Sheriff's Dispatcher will answer your call. There are numerous regulations to this effect. Whenever i fly Frontier from long island, i always see the piolets out side inspecting the plane! The de-ice crew screwed up bigtime. We knew what to look for, followed FFA window recs' and knew who to supervise. Not enough detail in this story to know if this event entailed one of these times or not, but the pictures look as though they did not deice prior to anti ice, which does not work. The captain reviews the maintenance log before the flight and can see what the mechanics were up to. . Seems like it'd be pretty easy to install a pinhole camera on the port/starboard sides of the aircraft directly overlooking each wing with a direct connection to the flight deck. Covering the journey to net zero emissions in aviation. Frontier Airlines. Un avin de la compaa estadounidense de bajo costo Frontier Airlines, que este viernes viajaba desde el Aeropuerto Internacional McCarran, en Las Vegas, con destino a Florida, sufri un desgarramiento de uno de sus motores, lo que caus un enorme susto en las decenas de pasajeros que viajaban a bordo. Discovery Company. At the same time, the pilots will work with air traffic control and airline operations to determine the best course of action (to divert or to continue) and get law enforcement personnel to meet the aircraft on arrival to deal with the passenger. Frontier Airlines free baggage voucher: Free Baggage: Expired: Online Coupon: Frontier Airlines $29 flights sale: From $29: Expired: Online Coupon: Frontier Airlines $34 flights on special: From . In the case of an inflight disruption from an unruly passenger, there are fewer tools airline employees have at their disposal than when on the ground. Reach out to us on one of our various channels below, at any time, and we will assist you shortly. I wouldnt take off without visual confirmation from a crew member or he company that the aircraft Id free of contaminants. Nothing of this sort has happened in the past 50+ years and we have vigorously attacked the underlying circumstances to prevent anything like this in the future.. Now a visual check of the nose in front of the cockpit, combined with not exceeding holdover time suffices. Our support team is just a click away! Flying in 2021 is a very different experience. Huge cudos to the Flight Attendant in this case! (@accidentes_aviacion) on Instagram: "(23/04/2023) Aeronave Boeing 737-800 de American Airlines, Matrcula . UU., coordinamos de cerca con distintas agencias federales y otras agencias para asegurarnos de estar operando continuamente segn las mejores prcticas de limpieza y desinfeccin de aviones. Do you realize how many hundreds of aspects of every flight you have ever been on rely on the pilots taking someones word for something? I guess they were just winging it when they ran low on deice fluid! Kind of like buying that "Gucci" bag at the flea market for $25 and it falls apart in a month. The FA went beyond their responsibility to look out the window and call in the situation. La aerolnea de bandera de Nueva Zelandia qued en primer lugar "debido a su excelente historial de incidentes, cantidad de innovaciones en la cabina, entrenamiento de pilotos y muy baja antigedad de la flota", segn Geoffrey Thomas, editor en jefe del sitio web australiano. partir de 86 . "Air New Zealand se ha destacado en el amplio espectro de seguridad sin perder nunca de vista el ms mnimo detalle mientras cuida a sus tripulaciones de vuelo que han trabajado bajo un estrs significativo", dijo Thomas a CNN Travel. Entre los mtodos que emplea, segn el estudio, est el monitoreo en tiempo real va satlite de los motores en los aviones de su flota, lo que le permite detectar con antelacin potenciales problemas de seguridad. I am surprised this could have happened (aside from the really poor culture in contract ground handling companies). Informed captain I previously worked on the ramp and had deiced aircraft in the past. This is not a blame game. Fuera de los cinco primeros de forma notable destaca Qantas, que ostent el ttulo de aerolnea ms segura del mundo de 2014 a 2017, as como de 2019 a 2021 (no hubo un ganador claro en 2018). Estas son las mejores aerolneas 0:48. Cameras should be fitted/retrofitted to at least ALL commercial airplanes flight surfaces - attached to cockpit monitors. Airlineratings.com menciona que, en cualquier caso, es una proporcin muy pequea comparada con los 3.600 millones de pasajeros que viajaron en 34 millones de vuelos comerciales el ao pasado. The same people who want to blame a pilot here would be wanking nonstop at the slightest inconvenience any of these things would cause if the pilots had to check them all. I check every plane as if my own family is on board. We trust that the de icing crew have done their jobs when they verbally confirm to us they have. (I'd be happy for someone to explain why there was no issue with this.). 2023 AeroInside. Continuing to make the flight crews fly blind of all behind the pit is utterly unacceptable & violates all safety & redundancy protocols already in place & championed by all. Some people are getting onboard an aircraft for the first time since early 2020 or 2019. Staying positive and keeping an upbeat attitude is one way to temper against the varied frustrations of flying in 2021. 4) pilots have to rely on other professionals to do what they say they are doingpilots must rely on the deicing crews to do what theyre trained to do. For more information, please contact a sales associate. At deicing area near taxi way our aircraft was deiced, Captain made PA prepare for take off. (CNN) -- El ao pasado result ser otro ao increblemente difcil para las aerolneas, ya que la cada en los viajes areos continu durante 2021 debido al impacto de la pandemia en curso. Airlines, Airbus, Boeing, FAA, Pilot Unions, Airline Insurance companies, etc: Are you listening? Las tres polmicas aerolneas rabes que toman por asalto el mercado mundial de la aviacin, Estados Unidos acuerda restablecer los vuelos de comerciales a Cuba. Frontier Airlines contina controlando de cerca las novedades relacionadas con la COVID-19. Pilots rely on load planners that the aircraft is loaded according to the paperwork they have given the captain for final approval. There was already ice buildup on the wing. 720-902-3969. privacy policy. AeroInside is part of the Tiny Ventures Network. Weve worked with Trego Dugan for almost 2 years now. Pilot in command should be terminated. El 737 se fabric originalmente para la "antigua" Frontier Airlines en 1982 y fue adquirido por United Airlines en 1986 cuando la primera cerr (ocho aos despus se form una nueva compaa area con el mismo nombre).A la fecha del accidente, la aeronave acumulaba aproximadamente 26.000 . Just curious, what's in the de-icing liquid/gas? Notified cockpit. Lee sobre nuestra postura acerca de enlaces externos. This also applies to your other passengers. The advantage of this procedure is to minimize the time between when an aircraft is deiced and departure. See more about our ethics policies here. Deicing/anti-icing is typically performed while the aircraft is under its own power. Were they asleep in the cockpit? I worked for a major airline 15 years. I am a flight attendant, had similar incident on night flight. Captain called me to confirm deicing satisfactory, I replied yes. Let us know in the comments! Stop sourcing jobs to save the small amount of money that you think you are saving. Rservez des vols pas chers oprs par Frontier Airlines de Las Vegas Athnes sur Trip.com. Certainly the freight operators don't have any windows on the fuselage to be able to look out let alone being able to get in the back with all the containers there, so they're not checking for contaminants. We will be adding press releases on a date forward status from today's date March 14, 2023. Find out more. Yes, there's blame to go around. Airlines, Airbus, Boeing, FAA, Pilot Unions, Airline Insurance companies, etc: Are you listening? Please do not take your frustrations out on them. Failure to properly deice (or deice at all) unnerves me more than anything else on a flight. I got to see it once on a runway tour in 2016 and found it fascinating right as they were planning to tear it down. They are responsible for informing the captain that the deicing/anti-icing procedure was performed, the aircraft is clear of contamination, and they provide the times of application of fluid so the crew is able to calculate what their holdover time is. The plane returned to the gate, where it was discovered that there was about a foot of snow . Ironically the vendor states this on their own website's home page: "Trego-Dugan delivers business vision, a midwest work ethic and unparalleled integrity.". Aircraft flight hours: 30442. Anyone remember the Air Florida accident? doesn't the pilot walk around the plane before flight? Shame on them. The plane returned to the gate, where it was discovered that there was about a foot of snow on the wings. Flight attendants do not control this policy. Aircraft deicing truck sprayed glycol second time. I was alarmed when I noticed there was snow and slush still on the wings and rang for an FA. I assume that we will never see you on a plane because checks are insufficient prior to take off. As a well worn airline PIC and SIC of over 30 years in the saddle, we always looked and in most cases if able, went outside to inspect the job done by the de-ice crew. Wow, my first thought was Air Florida, was that flight 90? Most likely, especially since you were on Southwest, your plane was only in PIT for a quick turnaround and the flight crew determined that snow/ice buildup wasn't an issue in the short time that aircraft was on the ground there. The main U.S. low-cost carriers are Spirit, Frontier, Allegiant, and Sun Country - all of which has never suffered a fatal accident. Huge cudos to the Flight Attendant in this case! An equally ridiculous suggestion would be for the cockpit crew to get out on the runway just before take off to make an inspection. After we pushed back from the gate and started to taxi to the runway, I saw something that I didn't like. Of course you can't 100% guarantee by looking out the window, but it would catch something like this. When I leave my house after a snow storm or any other "event", I check my vehicle to make sure I will be safe drive to wherever I am going.
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